I hate to inform you, this is as bad as Daily Kos

I really hate to break it to you, but while reading the headlines of recent posts about Obama, I'm wondering how anyone here who supports Hillary Clinton thinks this is better than Daily Kos other than it's the other guy who is getting bashed.

Bashing is bashing.  

Case in point, calling Reverend Wright.

He joined and remained active in a church where racism and anti-American hate is routinely preached. He and his family attended, and heavily contributed for about 20 years. This has received worldwide attention, as show in the link below.?
http://www.mydd.com/section/Diary/2

This sentiment was repeated in other diaries about how anti-American Rev. Wright is.  Of course, it fails to put the anger in a historical context and assumes that Obama is a liar.  Obama has said that he does not agree with many of the things that others are finding objectionable.  I've been to Churches where I was not very keen about some of the message but I also know that it's the whole package, the worship, the fellowship and the community that comes with belonging to a Church.

The AME Church is where the African American political movement was born.  It wasn't safe for Blacks to talk protest or politics in any other place other than their houses of worship.

The African Methodist Episcopal Church has a unique history in that it is the first major religious denomination in the Western World that had its origin over sociological rather than theological beliefs and differences, and the first African-American organized and incorporated denomination in the US. The AME church is also the church that sponsored the first independent historical black college, Wilberforce University. The church was born in protest against slavery--against dehumanization of African people, brought to the American continent as free labor. This fit well with the Methodist church's philosophy since its founder John Wesley had once called the slave-trade "that execrable sum of all villanies".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_Methodist_Episcopal_Church

United Church of Christ is another predominantly African American denomination but it is welcoming to all.  I belong to a UCC Church in my area and it's much different that Obama's Church.  Still, to say with a straight face that Obama's Church preaches "racism and anti-American hate" on a routine bases does not understand the context and ignores the fact that ten videos is hardly "routine" when put into the context of a twenty year time span.

For me, Obama rose above politics as usual and did not do the politically expedient thing by completely denouncing those twenty years in his Church.  I know if he had, there would be cries of another kind about him.  He did the right thing.

This kind of talk about either candidate does not help anyone and it seems like My DD is just as biased as Daily Kos.  



Display:


Re: I hate to inform you, this is as bad as Daily (2.00 / 2)

Unfortunately we are destined to have only echo chamber sites. This one will be for disillusioned Hillary supporters who take umbrage with Obama's nomination and vote for McCain and Huckabee.


"There's something horrible and undefeatable about people who have no life except the worship of power. People who don't want the meeting to end."
by campaignmonitor on Mon Mar 24, 2008 at 11:36:54 PM EST

Re: I hate to inform you, this is as bad as Daily (2.00 / 1)

It's not that bad.  From what I see, Obama support, i.e. change and Democratic support, is resurgent around MyDD.  Insurgent, resurgent, out, loud, and proud.


by howardpark on Mon Mar 24, 2008 at 11:41:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I hate to inform you, this is as bad as Daily (2.00 / 1)

I too have noticed more Obama supporters of late.


I'm as strong as a bull moose, and you can use me to the limit. - Teddy Roosevelt
by fogiv on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:04:54 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I hate to inform you, this is as bad as Daily (none / 0)

lol


by NY Writer on Mon Mar 24, 2008 at 11:41:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]

No, there is a HUGE difference (2.00 / 1)

I didn't just hide your comment just because you are an Obama supporter. This place is much, much different than the Orange Obama. Have you been there lately? Have you noticed even one pro Hillary diary in the last few weeks? When was the last time you saw a pro-Hillary diary on the rec list over there or on the front page? There is a huge difference between this place and Dkos.
by linc on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:12:48 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: No, there is a HUGE difference (2.00 / 2)

There's no pro-Hillary diaries because the pro-Hillary bloggers are boycotting DKos.


"Behold, I send you out as sheep amidst the wolves! Therefore, be as wise as a serpent, And as harmless as a dove."
by Setrak on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:17:38 AM EST
[ Parent ]

The vast majority of the pro-Hillary bloggers (2.00 / 2)

were STFU'd before the strike ever happened. You can spin it any which way you want, but Dkos is merely a sycophantic echo-chamber for Obama supporters anymore. Here and at places like Talkleft, Obama and Clinton supporters both frontpage and have rec'd diaries. Its actually really odd that I find Armando to be the most reasonable supporter for Obama on the nets-
by linc on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:28:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]

HRC never got more than 10% or so in the strawpoll (none / 0)

So figure 9 out of 10 at dkos wanted either Obama or Edwards. Most the Edwards support appears to have gone towards Obama, although some of that support is soft.

Here I would say its HRC supporters by a 2 to 1 or a 3 to 2 margin. Since the boycott/strike/whatever there have been more pro-Obama diaries - so I would guess that there are transplants from the big orange Satan that followed the HRC folks over to here.


by johnnyappleseed on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 02:56:56 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The vast majority of the pro-Hillary bloggers (none / 0)

Oddly though, the majority of recommend posts on here are not pro-Hillary either...  they are anti-Obama.


McCain/Palin... even scarier than Bush/Cheney... and that's saying something!
by JenKinFLA on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 01:10:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: No, there is a HUGE difference (none / 0)

Not many pro-Hillary diaries here, either...

ANTI-OBAMA diaries, though... well.... ya gots plenty o' them.


by zonk on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 09:41:40 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I hate to inform you, this is as bad as Daily (2.00 / 2)

At times it does get a little testy around here. But I think that here, many of us agree that HRC would be a better president. When I blogged on Kos, it was Obama land. So I think the two blogs represent different values--and both get out of hand.


by NY Writer on Mon Mar 24, 2008 at 11:37:56 PM EST

Re: I hate to inform you, this is as bad as Daily (2.00 / 2)

I think both would make a better President that McCain.

Even though I don't support Clinton, I still speak up at Daily Kos when I feel they've gone over the line.  It happens often, but if there is no balance the pendulum is allowed to swing so far it breaks.

Hope that makes sense.  I hate to see either candidate bashed but I do think it's fair to ask questions.  There is a difference.


Mr. Ellinorianne for CA State Senate! (Gary Pritchard ActBlue CA-SD-33)
by Ellinorianne on Mon Mar 24, 2008 at 11:41:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Just an FYI (2.00 / 1)

I have been to many UCC churches (they are a wonderful group of congregations) and know their church history- they can in no way be defined as a predominantly black church or a typical black church. They are, in fact, an extremely progressive/reformed, evangelical church within which Trinity is an anomaly- that is if we must describe churches by the color of the skin of the people who attend them. If we must, then most of the contributing congregations to the UCC are largely WASP in origin.
by linc on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:22:51 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I hate to inform you, this is as bad as Daily (2.00 / 3)

I blogged on Kos, it was Obama land.

and before that it was Edwards Land.  Those people shifted to Obama almost immediately because his policies are much closer to Edwards.   Hillary on the other hand assaulted the netroots with "lobbyists are people too!" and keeping the union buster Mark Penn on her team..  she was extremely dismissive of this group of voters as evidenced by the above and her belief the race would be over by february 5th (she didn't need us to get past super-tuesday so why does she need us now all of a sudden?)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iN9CYsaVY 7c


by soros on Mon Mar 24, 2008 at 11:42:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Wright is WRONG (1.33 / 12)

He joined and remained active in a church where racism and anti-American hate is routinely preached. He and his family attended, and heavily contributed for about 20 years. This has received worldwide attention...

Absolutely everything in this statement is 100% true.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Mon Mar 24, 2008 at 11:40:42 PM EST

Re: Wright is WRONG (2.00 / 3)

What about Tuzla?

Just admit it, you are sensationalizing it just like the right-wing malignant personalities of talk radio and Fox News.

Furthermore, you missed the entire point of this diary.


"Behold, I send you out as sheep amidst the wolves! Therefore, be as wise as a serpent, And as harmless as a dove."
by Setrak on Mon Mar 24, 2008 at 11:42:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wright is WRONG (2.00 / 2)

What about Tuzla? This diary is about Rev. Wright. If you want to write a diary about Tuzla, be my guest.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Mon Mar 24, 2008 at 11:59:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wright is WRONG (2.00 / 1)

...this diary isn't really about Wright.  Did you read the subject?


"Behold, I send you out as sheep amidst the wolves! Therefore, be as wise as a serpent, And as harmless as a dove."
by Setrak on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:18:32 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wright is WRONG (2.00 / 2)

This diary isn't about Tulza. Did you read the diary?

95% of the content discusses allegedly unfair bashing of Rev. Wright and his church. The problem is, the statements about Rev. Wright and his church are true.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:28:37 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wright is WRONG (2.00 / 2)

The problem is that you can't see the larger picture of the discussion.


"Behold, I send you out as sheep amidst the wolves! Therefore, be as wise as a serpent, And as harmless as a dove."
by Setrak on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:42:36 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wright is WRONG (2.00 / 3)

No, the problem is you want to give Obama a pass on his 20+ year relationship with Rev. Wright, and that's going to hurt the entire Democratic party.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:45:58 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wright is WRONG (2.00 / 1)

It was more about the fact that there is extremeness here that I find just as distasteful as the extreme bias at the Kos.


Mr. Ellinorianne for CA State Senate! (Gary Pritchard ActBlue CA-SD-33)
by Ellinorianne on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:42:41 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wright is WRONG (2.00 / 3)

Wright's views are EXTREME. It's really beyond comprehension that you either don't want or can't admit this relationship hurts our entire party.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:49:30 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wright is WRONG (2.00 / 1)

Obama said he doesn't agree with him, that's enough for me.  I felt his speech was perfect and I am an even more ardent supporter after it.

You don't seem to know the difference between what the candidate says and what someone in their personal life says.


Mr. Ellinorianne for CA State Senate! (Gary Pritchard ActBlue CA-SD-33)
by Ellinorianne on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 01:06:09 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wright is WRONG (2.00 / 2)

When I disagree with someone who's engaged in inflammatory hate speech, I walk out. I sure wouldn't financially support an individual who spouted these views. I live in Topeka, Kansas, and it would be akin to me sitting in Rev. Phelps' pew for 20 years and giving him 10% of my paycheck. No sane person would do such a thing.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 01:21:04 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wright is WRONG (2.00 / 1)

And I just don't agree that Wright equals Phelps.


Mr. Ellinorianne for CA State Senate! (Gary Pritchard ActBlue CA-SD-33)
by Ellinorianne on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 01:27:30 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wright is WRONG (2.00 / 3)

Hate speech is hate speech, regardless what ethic group or minority it's directed towards.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 01:30:33 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wright is WRONG (none / 0)

How many of Rev. Wrights speeches or sermons have you listened to...?  Or are you just judging him on the soundbytes...?

I'm just curious because to equate Rev. Wright with Phelps is absurd in the extreme


McCain/Palin... even scarier than Bush/Cheney... and that's saying something!
by JenKinFLA on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 01:15:43 PM EST
[ Parent ]

This is what I call Hyperbole (2.00 / 1)

rou·tine (rū-tēn') pronunciation
n.

  1. A prescribed, detailed course of action to be followed regularly; a standard procedure.
   2. A set of customary and often mechanically performed procedures or activities. See synonyms at method.
   3. A set piece of entertainment, especially in a nightclub or theater: The audience laughed at the comedian's routine.
   4. Slang. A particular kind of behavior or activity: Must you go into your hurt routine when you don't get your way?
   5. Computer Science. A set of programming instructions designed to perform a specific limited task.

adj.

  1. In accord with established procedure: a routine check of passports.
   2. Habitual; regular: made his routine trip to the store.
   3. Having no special quality; ordinary: a routine day.

There are TEN videos out of TWENTY years.  The oversimplification of this is astounding.


Mr. Ellinorianne for CA State Senate! (Gary Pritchard ActBlue CA-SD-33)
by Ellinorianne on Mon Mar 24, 2008 at 11:44:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

This is what I call "Reality Check" (2.00 / 1)

An assessment to determine if one's circumstances or expectations conform to reality.

A handful of Wright's sermons are only the tip of the iceberg. If Obama is the nominee, Rethugs will replay these tapes 24/7, and dig up hundreds more. Get used to it.  


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Mon Mar 24, 2008 at 11:56:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is what I call "Reality Check" (2.00 / 1)

"A handful of Wright's sermons are only the tip of the iceberg. "

On what basis do you make that analysis?

Would it be fair to say, "The Tuzla lie is just the tip of the iceberg. If Hillary is the nominee, Rethugs will replay her lies 24/7, and dig up hundreds more.  Get used to it."?


by furiousxgeorge on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:03:17 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is what I call "Reality Check" (1.33 / 3)

Have you even bothered to look at what Rev. Wright has to say about the GLB community? That's just a start...


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:17:56 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Ummm...have you? (2.00 / 3)

"With Obama competing with rival presidential contender Hillary Clinton for gay votes in the upcoming Pennsylvania primary, revelations of Wright's controversial sermons have raised questions among some activists about whether Obama's longtime pastor was among the preachers who delivered fire-and-brimstone sermons attacking homosexuality.

"Absolutely not," said Rick Garcia, political director of Equality Illinois, the Chicago-based state gay rights group.

"Trinity has been among the strongest supporters of LGBT rights," Garcia said. "I have the highest regard and admiration for Rev. Wright.""

http://www.washblade.com/thelatest/thela test.cfm?blog_id=17266


by furiousxgeorge on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:20:14 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Ummm...have YOU? (2.00 / 1)

Quote the rest of the article:

But the Rev. Ruth Garwood, executive director of the United Church of Christ Coalition for GLBT Concerns, said that while Trinity Church has the reputation of being gay-supportive, Wright and other church officials never accepted an invitation from her office to become an official UCC "open and affirming" congregation for the GLBT community.

And...

according to Rev. Irene Monroe, a religion columnist for gay media and a doctoral candidate at Harvard Divinity School....said some gay members of Trinity expressed disappointment over Wright's response to a controversial 2005 decision by the United Church of Christ's national governing body to endorse same-sex marriage.

About 80 percent of the church's General Synod voted to approve a same-sex marriage resolution giving all United Church of Christ congregations authority to perform same-sex marriages. The resolution explicitly allows each church to decide on its own whether or not to endorse or perform such unions.

Monroe said Wright spoke out against the Synod's position, which she said prompted "LGBTQ parishioners to leave" the church.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:38:46 AM EST
[ Parent ]

You are pathetic. (2.00 / 1)

You are drowning in your own idiocy, you are wrong and you should apologize.  How about we KEEP QUOTING....

"She points to an article written at that time by Wright in The Trumpet, his church's magazine, calling the same-sex marriage issue a distraction that diverted attention from other, more important issues such as health care and poverty.

"Are 44 million Americans with no health care insurance less important than `gay marriage?' he wrote. "Why aren't Black Christians in an uproar about that? Maybe I'm missing something!"

In a column slated to be published this week in the gay press, Monroe said Wright's comments in the church magazine highlighted what appeared to be his decision to break ranks with "his liberal denomination to stand in solidarity with a more conservative black church position."

Tracy Baim, editor of Windy City Times, a gay newspaper in Chicago, said Wright has never carried any religious objections to same-sex marriage into the political sphere in Illinois, where the City of Chicago and the state legislature have passed far-reaching gay rights laws.

"He has never been a barrier to gay rights at all," Baim said."

Or, everybody can go read the full article their damn selves.  Anyone who comes out of it thinking he is anti-gay is working a biased agenda.

http://www.washblade.com/thelatest/thela test.cfm?blog_id=17266


by furiousxgeorge on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:46:58 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wright Against Gay Rights (2.00 / 1)

Explain that to all the LGBTQ parishioners who left Rev. Wright's church when he refused to support gay marriage and refused to to become an official UCC "open and affirming" congregation for the GLBT community.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:54:35 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wright Against Gay Rights (none / 0)

It's kind of funny your relentless need to chop out one thing from an entire, long article.  This is a gay friendly publication that did an in-depth article and came to the conclusion he supports gay rights.  

 It reeks of hysteria and anti-obama derangement that you cannot accept their word.  It's almost a tiny, pathetic, mirror image of the rest of the controversy that was smeared all over Fox and YouTube.

On the invitation to be open and affirming:

"Wadley said he doesn't know why Trinity has yet to follow the other UCC churches in adopting the "open and affirming" status. But he said Trinity is clearly following the spirit of the declaration based on the support he and other gay church members have received."

TRINITY IS CLEARLY FOLLOWING THE SPIRIT OF THE DECLARATI0N.

On gay marriage:

He rejected it on religious grounds, as is his right.  He does not reject the right of gay people to marry, he rejected it for UCC.  

Are we going down the path of calling the entire Catholic Church anti-gay bigots because they have some seriously messed up views on it?  Or anyone who doesn't think the Catholic Church should marry gays?

I don't think the Catholic Church should, but I fully support the United States government approving gay marriage.   I see it as a fundamental human right.

"?`Good News for Homosexuals'

Cheeks, of D.C.'s Inner Light Ministries, said Wright has championed gay rights causes by speaking out on behalf of gays in religious forums for nearly two decades, a development that Cheeks said provides a counterbalance to claims by critics that Wright has delivered divisive sermons.

In one of his sermons of the early 1990s, titled, "Good News for Homosexuals," Wright told of how he believes God does not limit his love to heterosexuals.

"I refuse to limit my God, to lock God into my cultural understandings because culture is fickle," Wright said. "And culture is often wrong. Culture was wrong about slavery. Culture was wrong about women. Culture was wrong about Africans and Indians, and culture was wrong about Christ," he said. "I have been the pariah among many of my clergy colleagues who somehow see me as defective or not quite saved because I won't join them in their homophobic gay bashing and misquoting of scripture.""


by furiousxgeorge on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 01:08:51 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wright Against Gay Rights (2.00 / 1)

Wright doesn't support gay marriage, and doesn't support his own denomination's attempt to become "inclusive" to welcome LGBTQ parishioners. Many LGBTQ people have left his church.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 01:28:02 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wright Against Gay Rights (none / 0)

Tracy Baim, editor of Windy City Times, a gay newspaper in Chicago, said Wright has never carried any religious objections to same-sex marriage into the political sphere in Illinois, where the City of Chicago and the state legislature have passed far-reaching gay rights laws.Tracy Baim, editor of Windy City Times, a gay newspaper in Chicago, said Wright has never carried any religious objections to same-sex marriage into the political sphere in Illinois, where the City of Chicago and the state legislature have passed far-reaching gay rights laws.Tracy Baim, editor of Windy City Times, a gay newspaper in Chicago, said Wright has never carried any religious objections to same-sex marriage into the political sphere in Illinois, where the City of Chicago and the state legislature have passed far-reaching gay rights laws.Tracy Baim, editor of Windy City Times, a gay newspaper in Chicago, said Wright has never carried any religious objections to same-sex marriage into the political sphere in Illinois, where the City of Chicago and the state legislature have passed far-reaching gay rights laws.Tracy Baim, editor of Windy City Times, a gay newspaper in Chicago, said Wright has never carried any religious objections to same-sex marriage into the political sphere in Illinois, where the City of Chicago and the state legislature have passed far-reaching gay rights laws.
But he said Trinity is clearly following the spirit of the declaration based on the support he and other gay church members have received.But he said Trinity is clearly following the spirit of the declaration based on the support he and other gay church members have received.But he said Trinity is clearly following the spirit of the declaration based on the support he and other gay church members have received.But he said Trinity is clearly following the spirit of the declaration based on the support he and other gay church members have received.
Tracy Baim, editor of Windy City Times, a gay newspaper in Chicago, said Wright has never carried any religious objections to same-sex marriage into the political sphere in Illinois, where the City of Chicago and the state legislature have passed far-reaching gay rights laws.Tracy Baim, editor of Windy City Times, a gay newspaper in Chicago, said Wright has never carried any religious objections to same-sex marriage into the political sphere in Illinois, where the City of Chicago and the state legislature have passed far-reaching gay rights laws.Tracy Baim, editor of Windy City Times, a gay newspaper in Chicago, said Wright has never carried any religious objections to same-sex marriage into the political sphere in Illinois, where the City of Chicago and the state legislature have passed far-reaching gay rights laws.Tracy Baim, editor of Windy City Times, a gay newspaper in Chicago, said Wright has never carried any religious objections to same-sex marriage into the political sphere in Illinois, where the City of Chicago and the state legislature have passed far-reaching gay rights laws.Tracy Baim, editor of Windy City Times, a gay newspaper in Chicago, said Wright has never carried any religious objections to same-sex marriage into the political sphere in Illinois, where the City of Chicago and the state legislature have passed far-reaching gay rights laws.
But he said Trinity is clearly following the spirit of the declaration based on the support he and other gay church members have received.But he said Trinity is clearly following the spirit of the declaration based on the support he and other gay church members have received.But he said Trinity is clearly following the spirit of the declaration based on the support he and other gay church members have received.But he said Trinity is clearly following the spirit of the declaration based on the support he and other gay church members have received.
Tracy Baim, editor of Windy City Times, a gay newspaper in Chicago, said Wright has never carried any religious objections to same-sex marriage into the political sphere in Illinois, where the City of Chicago and the state legislature have passed far-reaching gay rights laws.Tracy Baim, editor of Windy City Times, a gay newspaper in Chicago, said Wright has never carried any religious objections to same-sex marriage into the political sphere in Illinois, where the City of Chicago and the state legislature have passed far-reaching gay rights laws.Tracy Baim, editor of Windy City Times, a gay newspaper in Chicago, said Wright has never carried any religious objections to same-sex marriage into the political sphere in Illinois, where the City of Chicago and the state legislature have passed far-reaching gay rights laws.Tracy Baim, editor of Windy City Times, a gay newspaper in Chicago, said Wright has never carried any religious objections to same-sex marriage into the political sphere in Illinois, where the City of Chicago and the state legislature have passed far-reaching gay rights laws.Tracy Baim, editor of Windy City Times, a gay newspaper in Chicago, said Wright has never carried any religious objections to same-sex marriage into the political sphere in Illinois, where the City of Chicago and the state legislature have passed far-reaching gay rights laws.
But he said Trinity is clearly following the spirit of the declaration based on the support he and other gay church members have received.But he said Trinity is clearly following the spirit of the declaration based on the support he and other gay church members have received.But he said Trinity is clearly following the spirit of the declaration based on the support he and other gay church members have received.But he said Trinity is clearly following the spirit of the declaration based on the support he and other gay church members have received.

Need more?


by furiousxgeorge on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 01:37:09 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wright Against Gay Rights (2.00 / 1)

Repeating an excerpt 3 times doesn't change the content of the entire article.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 01:39:27 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wright Against Gay Rights (none / 0)

A lot of churches do not support gay marriage.

If we start throwing out pastors and preachers based on that alone, there will be none left.


McCain/Palin... even scarier than Bush/Cheney... and that's saying something!
by JenKinFLA on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 01:17:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]

hey asshat (none / 0)

And I say that in love.
Check this shit out.
http://www.washblade.com/thelatest/thela test.cfm?blog_id=17266
Because I wont trade humanity for patriotism!
by Drewid on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:31:23 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Yes, check it out (2.00 / 1)

Obviously you missed the part where "Wright and other church officials never accepted an invitation... to become an official UCC "open and affirming" congregation for the GLBT community" and Wright does NOT support gay marriage.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:41:26 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Yes, check it out (2.00 / 1)

"Tracy Baim, editor of Windy City Times, a gay newspaper in Chicago, said Wright has never carried any religious objections to same-sex marriage into the political sphere in Illinois, where the City of Chicago and the state legislature have passed far-reaching gay rights laws."


by furiousxgeorge on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:48:55 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Yes, check it out (2.00 / 1)

Rev. Wright hasn't "carried any religious objections to same sex marriage into the political sphere" because he already vocally and forcefully opposes them in his own church. He does NOT support gay marriage, and does NOT support his congregation becoming an official UCC "open and affirming" congregation for the GLBT community.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:58:17 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Yes, check it out (2.00 / 1)

You are repeating yourself, and you look silly.  It's making me have to repeat myself.

"Wadley said he doesn't know why Trinity has yet to follow the other UCC churches in adopting the "open and affirming" status. But he said Trinity is clearly following the spirit of the declaration based on the support he and other gay church members have received."

"But he said Trinity is clearly following the spirit of the declaration based on the support he and other gay church members have received.""

"But he said Trinity is clearly following the spirit of the declaration based on the support he and other gay church members have received."

There, now you can repeat yourself a bunch more and pretend you are making a point.


by furiousxgeorge on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 01:17:01 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Yes, check it out (2.00 / 1)

Wright doesn't support gay marriage, and doesn't support his own church offically becoming an "inclusive" church under the guidelines of his own denomination. No amount of spin changes these facts.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 01:24:48 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Yes, check it out (none / 0)

Tracy Baim, editor of Windy City Times, a gay newspaper in Chicago, said Wright has never carried any religious objections to same-sex marriage into the political sphere in Illinois, where the City of Chicago and the state legislature have passed far-reaching gay rights laws.Tracy Baim, editor of Windy City Times, a gay newspaper in Chicago, said Wright has never carried any religious objections to same-sex marriage into the political sphere in Illinois, where the City of Chicago and the state legislature have passed far-reaching gay rights laws.Tracy Baim, editor of Windy City Times, a gay newspaper in Chicago, said Wright has never carried any religious objections to same-sex marriage into the political sphere in Illinois, where the City of Chicago and the state legislature have passed far-reaching gay rights laws.Tracy Baim, editor of Windy City Times, a gay newspaper in Chicago, said Wright has never carried any religious objections to same-sex marriage into the political sphere in Illinois, where the City of Chicago and the state legislature have passed far-reaching gay rights laws.Tracy Baim, editor of Windy City Times, a gay newspaper in Chicago, said Wright has never carried any religious objections to same-sex marriage into the political sphere in Illinois, where the City of Chicago and the state legislature have passed far-reaching gay rights laws.
But he said Trinity is clearly following the spirit of the declaration based on the support he and other gay church members have received.But he said Trinity is clearly following the spirit of the declaration based on the support he and other gay church members have received.But he said Trinity is clearly following the spirit of the declaration based on the support he and other gay church members have received.But he said Trinity is clearly following the spirit of the declaration based on the support he and other gay church members have received.

Shall I just keep quoting till your cognitive dissonance fades?


by furiousxgeorge on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 01:36:13 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Yes, check it out (2.00 / 1)

You can copy and paste until the cows come home, and that won't change the fact that Rev. Wright doesn't support gay marriage, or making his own congregation a welcoming and inclusive church to LGBTQ people under the official UCC guidelines.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 01:43:28 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is what I call "Reality Check" (none / 0)

Wait let's just dwell on this a moment shall we?

You were asked on what evidence you predicted that the Republicans would dig up "hundreds more" Wright videos and run it 24/7.

Fair enough.

You responded with an allusion to what "Wright has to say about the GLB community"...because, as everyone knows, if there is one thing Republicans go to the mat for it is gay rights.

HAHAHA! Good one!


by tessellated on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 01:08:59 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is what I call "Reality Check" (none / 0)

Not to mention, all signs point to him being gay friendly.   We can quibble about gay marriage but the guy has done tons of outreach to the gay community and welcomes them in his Church.  There aren't going to be any nasty videos to dig up on it.


by furiousxgeorge on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 01:20:13 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Hey dumbass (none / 0)

Rev. Wright is NOT running for President.

Can you get that through your thick skull?


by bawbie on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 09:13:52 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is what I call "Reality Check" (2.00 / 2)

We are used to it.  It's how they operate.  No matter the nominee.  Par for the course.  The question is, are we going to be hearing it from fellow democrats (ie you) as well?


John McCain defends Bush's Iraq strategy.
by recusancy on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:06:32 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is what I call "Reality Check" (none / 0)

No, actually you just proved my point.  Thanks.

Reality is one thing, hyperbole is another.


Mr. Ellinorianne for CA State Senate! (Gary Pritchard ActBlue CA-SD-33)
by Ellinorianne on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:06:53 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is what I call "Reality Check" (2.00 / 1)

Indeed it is.


I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.
by KnowVox on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:18:27 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Let me ask you some things (2.00 / 0)

Do they tell you at your church that white people introduced AIDS and drugs for purposes of killing off the black community?  Do they tell you that you even if your succeed in school the white man will try to deny you?  Did your pastor give a humorous little analogy about how Bill Clinton "rode dirty" on black people like he tried to do with Monica Lewinski?


by lombard on Mon Mar 24, 2008 at 11:58:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Let me ask you some things (none / 0)

All wrong and Obama said so.  I have disagreed with people I adore and whom I trust but they've said things that were awful.

Sometimes their anger and hurt blinds them to things and there are many who believe what he says.


Mr. Ellinorianne for CA State Senate! (Gary Pritchard ActBlue CA-SD-33)
by Ellinorianne on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:22:43 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Sure, we can disagree and still like people (2.00 / 0)

But I wouldn't have thought of sending my child to my George Wallace voting old uncle for weekly sermons.  And I've never even claimed to be "post-racial."


by lombard on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:32:37 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Sure, we can disagree and still like people (none / 0)

More hyperbole, more unfair comparisons and more extreme comparisons.  

I'm just shocked.


Mr. Ellinorianne for CA State Senate! (Gary Pritchard ActBlue CA-SD-33)
by Ellinorianne on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 01:07:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Yeah, well shock yourself out (none / 0)

typical reaction


by lombard on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 01:08:58 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I hate to inform you, this is as bad as Daily (2.00 / 4)

It is unfortunate that you are right.  Rather than try to prove themselves better than "the Orange Evil," many on MyDD have decided to fight fire with fire.

The only difference is that at DailyKos, there is a lot more unity against the failed policies of the Republican Party including the flagrant propaganda of the right wing.  Here on MyDD, an increasing number have turned to the "dark side of politics" in their desperation.


"Behold, I send you out as sheep amidst the wolves! Therefore, be as wise as a serpent, And as harmless as a dove."
by Setrak on Mon Mar 24, 2008 at 11:41:29 PM EST

So much sanctimoniousness... (none / 0)

...so little time.

...and from a bunch of folks in a diary that, when it's now read with its comments, is--with great irony--certainly among the most confrontational and divisive of the day here on MyDD, too!

If you folks are looking to pick a bunch of fights, you better spread out and start commenting on other diaries on this blog. It's gettin' let. And, clearly, you've got a job to do! LOL!


by bobswern on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:00:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So much sanctimoniousness... (2.00 / 1)

Look, I rarely comment at Daily Kos because I feel it's overboard as well and I came here.  I don't see much difference and that's how I feel.

I support Obama but would support Clinton in a heartbeat if she was the nominee, no questions asked.

I don't think it's been fair that Clinton has been linked to surrogates and what they've said.  Now, when people say things as her "reps" on conference calls, that's another matter.

I think there has been awful things said on both sides and for either to claim the high ground right now is laughable.  


Mr. Ellinorianne for CA State Senate! (Gary Pritchard ActBlue CA-SD-33)
by Ellinorianne on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:25:48 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Well your side loves to be apologists for hate (2.00 / 0)

Just consider the context of Hillary supporter persecution at places like Daily Kos and Talking Points Memo and others.  We were driven away from there and castigated as uneducated old biddies and trailer trash by the ruling power majority.  

So, the historical context of the Hillary supporter anger must be understood.  We are the oppressed minority on the netroots and we are justified in our negative feelings and the rage toward Obama supporters.  Our dislike of you is perfectly understandable when viewed in the historical context of the liberal netroots.  


by lombard on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:11:42 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Well your side loves to be apologists for hate (none / 0)

Did I persecute you?  No.  Don't act like I did, and don't act like two wrongs make a right.  How old are we?


"Behold, I send you out as sheep amidst the wolves! Therefore, be as wise as a serpent, And as harmless as a dove."
by Setrak on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:24:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]

I was being sarcastic (none / 0)

Maybe you believe in such nonsense and that's why the sarcasm wasn't obvious.  


by lombard on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:27:06 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Well your side loves to be apologists for hate (none / 0)

Did you really use the term "oppressed minority"?  Did you type that with a straight face?

Being shouted down on a website does not make you a "oppressed minority", not even close.


Mr. Ellinorianne for CA State Senate! (Gary Pritchard ActBlue CA-SD-33)
by Ellinorianne on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:27:01 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Of course I didn't do it with a straight face (none / 0)

I don't believe in such self-serving nonsense.


by lombard on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:28:52 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Hypocrisy knows no bounds (none / 0)

LOL

Isn't this basically the same argument that Obama supporters use regarding Rev. Wright?

But when we do so, we're called racists or America haters.  

My goodness, the gall it must take to use that same argument after so thoroughly and gleefully making every attempt to trash it as invalid and based in racism and hate.  


No way. No how. No McCain.
by freedom78 on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:58:52 AM EST
[ Parent ]

I was being sarcastic (none / 0)

Geeze, many liberal people are humor and sarcasm challenged.  I wouldn't even consider that someone was serious who wrote such garbage as this.  The title line alone on the posts should have given it away.


by lombard on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 01:07:41 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I was being sarcastic (none / 0)

Oh, I'm aware that you knew what you were doing.  

The question, then, is which you really believe:

#1: That if Wright was guilty of hate speech, and this issue of historical context has been raised to justify or at least explain what he said, then that same excuse can be used for anti-Obama hate.  Of course, this then justifies the historical context issue.

or

#2: That you're trying to show the historical context issue to be false, and are applying it to something that Obama supporters wouldn't want it applied to, in order to show them what you see as the ridiculousness of their position.

But more likely it's #3...essentially #2 combined with the belief that what goes on here is not, in fact, hate of a very troubling variety.


No way. No how. No McCain.
by freedom78 on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 01:18:22 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Yes, #3. Thank you very much! (none / 0)

You explained the motivation much better than I could have!


by lombard on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 01:27:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Yes, #3. Thank you very much! (none / 0)

Lol.

Happy to help.


No way. No how. No McCain.
by freedom78 on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 01:43:14 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Well your side loves to be apologists for hate (none / 0)

I got your joke immediately.  I smiled.  I think it's strange that the three people above me didn't get it.

In my opinion the shrillness is several orders of magnitude higher at Kos, TPM, HuffPo...


by Apostle on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 01:17:19 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Thanks! (none / 0)


by lombard on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 01:28:00 AM EST
[ Parent ]

MARKOS is an idiot (none / 0)

We can all agree on that, right?  I mean, he's a total buffoon who has screwed us with his attempt to game the republican primary.


Until recently I was selling drugs, and now I'm selling Obama T-shirts.
by switching sides on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 07:59:37 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: MARKOS is an idiot (none / 0)

Short answer no...  Markos is not an idiot.


McCain/Palin... even scarier than Bush/Cheney... and that's saying something!
by JenKinFLA on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 01:21:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I hate to inform you, this is as bad as Daily (none / 0)

The only difference is that at DailyKos, there is a lot more unity against the failed policies of the Republican Party including the flagrant propaganda of the right wing.  Here on MyDD, an increasing number have turned to the "dark side of politics" in their desperation.

Trenchant observation. You wouldn't happen to favor Obama, would you?


by NY Writer on Mon Mar 24, 2008 at 11:42:49 PM EST

LOL! These commenters speak objectively! (none / 0)

Just ask them, and they'll tell you that!

Oh...on second thought, you don't even have to ask them; they're already letting you know this!


by bobswern on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:04:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]

I hate to inform you, this is worse than Daily Kos (2.00 / 1)

I agree with the Diarist.


It's time to restore balance and fairness to our economy,... It's time to stop giving tax cuts to corporations that ship jobs overseas... - Barack Obama
by Lefty Coaster on Mon Mar 24, 2008 at 11:44:48 PM EST

Well, you don't have to put up with us Hill lovers (2.00 / 0)

You can always go back to Kos.


by lombard on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:01:22 AM EST
[ Parent ]

What and let this turn into an eccho chamber? (none / 0)

The invective towards the opposing candidate that I see here is turned up a couple notches higher than what I normally saw at Kos.


It's time to restore balance and fairness to our economy,... It's time to stop giving tax cuts to corporations that ship jobs overseas... - Barack Obama
by Lefty Coaster on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 03:44:52 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Yeah (2.00 / 1)

Thank you Ellinorianne.
BTW I thought the UCC as a whole was more of a mixed/white denomination than an African-American one.
I know that the UCC is one of the more denominations that is more accepting of the LBGT community.

Because I wont trade humanity for patriotism!
by Drewid on Mon Mar 24, 2008 at 11:45:22 PM EST

Re: Yeah (2.00 / 2)

You're right, TUCC is predominately African-American, while UCC is predominately white.


"Behold, I send you out as sheep amidst the wolves! Therefore, be as wise as a serpent, And as harmless as a dove."
by Setrak on Mon Mar 24, 2008 at 11:48:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Yeah (2.00 / 2)

DOH, sorry, I guess I don't know my Church that well :)  I'm new to it.

Thanks for the correction.


Mr. Ellinorianne for CA State Senate! (Gary Pritchard ActBlue CA-SD-33)
by Ellinorianne on Mon Mar 24, 2008 at 11:53:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Yeah (2.00 / 1)

And that is why I belong.  It's an affirming Church and considering how white my neighborhood is, it makes me so happy to see black faces in my congregation.  They've already integrated their Sundays!


Mr. Ellinorianne for CA State Senate! (Gary Pritchard ActBlue CA-SD-33)
by Ellinorianne on Mon Mar 24, 2008 at 11:51:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Yeah (none / 0)

Hey! So has mine! Of course, it's a Catholic church, it has had 'black faces' since the 1840s.


by souvarine on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:19:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Yeah (none / 0)

I don't know if that was snark or what.  I was just saying that I began going to this Church.  It's small.  I was going to a much bigger Church and rarely saw any "diversity".  Sorry, but it's what I've seen in one Church.

It was meant as a good thing but you had to turn it into something ugly.  Thanks.


Mr. Ellinorianne for CA State Senate! (Gary Pritchard ActBlue CA-SD-33)
by Ellinorianne on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:31:27 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Yeah (none / 0)

It's not snark, my church was founded for African Americans and immigrants. But I have always attended integrated churches, it seems odd to me to celebrate that a church is becoming integrated 40 years after MLK.

I deeply disagree with some of what the Catholic church teaches, but it is a diverse church. I chose a pastor who is helping the church move past those teachings, I would never put up with a bigoted priest.

Your diary attacks a poster who refuses to excuse bigotry, I find that ugly.


by souvarine on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 01:03:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]

According to Pastordan (2.00 / 2)

Pastordan of Dkos and also of UCC, Sen Obama's so-slandered "racist down-with-Whitey" Trinity UCC parish has funded many of the smaller mostly-white parishes in the Chicago area.  The Trinity church is most black, but it is also by far the biggest individual church in the region.  SO they help uplift the smaller, whiter churches.

So very racist eh?  But I am sure the hate-throwers posting here know far, far more than you and pastordan who actually belong to the organization.

(Sorry if 'parrish' is teh wrong word.)


Take your fear and shove it, it ain't workin' on us no more.
by Quicklund on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:28:20 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Minor detail (none / 0)

isn't it?  Thanks for sharing.


Mr. Ellinorianne for CA State Senate! (Gary Pritchard ActBlue CA-SD-33)
by Ellinorianne on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:35:56 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Minor detail? Did I misread your diary? (none / 0)

I thought your point was to put Rev Wright's comments in a wider, less inflamnitory context.  I thought that debunking the notion Trinty Church is a racist organization would be rather on-tpic to your point.  My apologies.


Take your fear and shove it, it ain't workin' on us no more.
by Quicklund on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 01:00:08 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Minor detail? Did I misread your diary? (none / 0)

I was thanking you!  And it was sincere.  I meant minor detail as in sarcasm, it's a huge detail and it's very important.


Mr. Ellinorianne for CA State Senate! (Gary Pritchard ActBlue CA-SD-33)
by Ellinorianne on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 01:10:30 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Yeah (2.00 / 3)

Wright has been very good to the LGBT community.

http://www.washblade.com/thelatest/thela test.cfm?blog_id=17266


John McCain defends Bush's Iraq strategy.
by recusancy on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:01:35 AM EST
[ Parent ]

I weep (2.00 / 2)

I am not a church goer.
I have deep faith in Christ.
Not so much the supposed holy writ.
Not so much organized churches.
I don't begrudge others for their faith and how they choose to practice it.
And I weep for the crucifiction of Trinity and Rev. Wright. I can understand it from the traditional media and wingnut zealots, it pains me to see it coming from supposed progresives.

Because I wont trade humanity for patriotism!
by Drewid on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:13:55 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Yeah (none / 0)

Obama will make a fine VP if he'll simply throw Wright under the bus as he has done to his own grandmother.


Until recently I was selling drugs, and now I'm selling Obama T-shirts.
by switching sides on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 08:03:37 AM EST
[ Parent ]

The reality on Wright (2.00 / 2)

Two things.

First, racism and truly offensive content in that Church was the exception, not the rule.  If it was customary to say such racist things in the Church and if it was as widespread and virulent as some claim...there is no excuse for the Clinton's having invited him to the prayer dinner.  You guys can't have it both ways here.

Second, as a political attack the Wright thing has blown over.  

http://weblogs.baltimoresun.com/news/pol itics/blog/2008/03/obamaclinton_tie_in_n ew_poll_p.html

" Obama is the choice of 47 percent, Clinton 46, a neglible difference in a poll like this, a March 20-22 survey by the Gallup Poll. The survey confirms Gallup's finding just before Easter that "Clinton's recent lead in the race -- apparently fueled by controversy dogging the Obama campaign over the Rev. Jeremiah Wright -- had evaporated,'' Gallup's Lydia Saad reports.

For all the controversy that Obama has faced during the past few weeks surrounding the "incendiary'' remarks of his longtime and now-retired pastor, remarks which the candidate has disavowed, the last two accountings of the Gallup daily tracker suggest that the senator from Illinois has placed that behind him. Clinton had gained a detectable polling advantage over Obama during the height of the controversy.

Gallup's general election polling, matching presumptive Republican nominee Sen. John McCain against Obama and Clinton, continue to show McCain holding a slight advantage.

The Arizona senator holds a three percentage point lead over Obama in the preferences of registered voters, and a two-point lead over Clinton, again, within the margin of error."
-----------

It was no Dean scream.  It may hurt him, but it didn't and won't kill him.  If you are resting your hopes on Hillary's nomination on a Wright based implosion, you should probably look for something else...like maybe try and win some delegates.


by furiousxgeorge on Mon Mar 24, 2008 at 11:45:54 PM EST

Re: I hate to inform you, this is as bad as Daily (2.00 / 2)

I find it interesting..  it's hard to be in the middle here... I'm voting for th Dem in November no matter what, so that's kinda what I am..  Do I have a preference...?  Sure, but it really doesn't matter since my mind is made up how to cast my vote already...

But the constant barrage of vitriol...  I found myself questioning the Democratic patronage of people tonight several times in one diary...  Someone called for Obama to be publicly humiliated...  Ummm...  What...??  He is a Democratic Senator.

We are becoming what we have beheld in a lot of ways...  But for those that decry DKos as an echo chamber, mydd is an echo chamber too...  the echo just sounds a little different.


McCain/Palin... even scarier than Bush/Cheney... and that's saying something!
by JenKinFLA on Mon Mar 24, 2008 at 11:49:24 PM EST

Re: I hate to inform you, this is as bad as Daily (2.00 / 0)

In the middle? Right, and Donna Brazile is a neutral super delegate. How stupid do you think we are?


by souvarine on Mon Mar 24, 2008 at 11:55:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

To Jen in Fla (1.50 / 2)

JeninFLA; can I just add what a voice of reason you (and a few others) are in this disgusting den of poison. I have noticed your comments over the past couple of weeks (I'm guessing you only joined recently) and there is a decency to them. An old fashioned decency. I am shocked and ashamed of some of the deceitful, bitter wretchedness this website offers up. The arrogance and entitlement of some of Hillary's supporters would be embarrassing in a kindergarten. Your candidate and her team fucked up. She still has a chance. I think it is much more than the 10% quoted recently by anonymous members of her team. But nothing I read on this site would persuade anyone to vote for her - well only those who have been dreaming of another Clinton administration for the last several years. It hurts when those you love (honor,respect & worship) fuck up. It is painful to see them hurt and struggle and fight. But support her, donate to her campaign, canvass for her, get out her vote. You remind me of the soccer Dads and Moms at my sons soccer games whose instinct is to yell at the other players and the ref rather than encourage your own child and his team. Your a goal or two down. You just need to play better.


by thewholeofthemoon on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 12:14:33 AM EST
[ Parent ]

THen go away (none / 0)

GO BACK to KOS, troll.


Until recently I was selling drugs, and now I'm selling Obama T-shirts.
by switching sides on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 08:04:29 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: To Jen in Fla (2.00 / 1)

Thanks....  I have found myself defending Obama more nd more lately, but I will happily vote for Clinton if she is the nominee.  I will happily vote for either of them.  They are both head and shoulders above McCain.  Another 4 years of Republican rule would probably do us in.


McCain/Palin... even scarier than Bush/Cheney... and that's saying something!
by JenKinFLA on Tue Mar 25, 2008 at 01:24:37 PM EST
[